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 Super Smash Bros. Discussion

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Arii

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:19 pm

I guess. It's not very technical at all. Like I said, it's like a very old fighter. Variations on certain combos pretty much, but that's about it.

That's all it should be though. It's Smash Brothers, not Tatsunoku vs Capcom or something.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Wed Jul 15, 2009 9:27 pm

Arii wrote:
I guess. It's not very technical at all. Like I said, it's like a very old fighter. Variations on certain combos pretty much, but that's about it.

That's all it should be though. It's Smash Brothers, not Tatsunoku vs Capcom or something.

Eh it's different. Not infinite combo central like ________ vs. Capcom

What makes Smash Bros. competitive and deep, is that it is 90% mind games, and strategy.

You have to get your Shikamaru on playing Smash bros, where as something like Street Fighter is more baiting/predicting, and being quick enough for combos.

Smash Bros. tho, you'll prolly never lose the same way twice.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Thu Jul 16, 2009 12:15 am

i will kill with Pokemon Trainer, Sonic, Link, and icarus. BITCHES.
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Ron

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Thu Jul 16, 2009 11:49 pm

Lol i'll beat you with zelda then jason. She's about as tall as link.

I'll say this again.

If your a newb in Smash Bros of course it's not gonna seem technical.

Like I said on LoW, pick up a copy of melee, get into the competitive scene, and then come back and say the same thing about smash brothers.

Even though brawl has had some melee advanced techniques removed, there have still been a ton of new ones found. Hell a beginner can't even do the simplest technique in brawl, which is glide tossing.

Same way traditonal fighters have their advanced techniques, brawl has it's AT's to that only the pros know about.

If I were new to tatsunoko, I'd say the shit was simple as fuck. I mean what's hard about just button mashing and rotating the control stick and pressing multiple buttons(which is how u do a special)? I wouldn't know shit about even the most basic techniques in the game like Baroque, Mega Crash, Tech Guarding,etc.

So Ari just read up a bit on Smash bros and it's competitive history. I mean shit if the game was as simple as your saying, why do niggas like MLG, a group of PRO gamers, recognize smash brothers games as competitive and play against other gamers in competitive tournaments with prizes and such? They don't just do that for any old basic ass fighting game.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:47 am

Well most basic fighting games don't let Mario smack up Princess Peach.

It'd be famous regardless.

There are a ton of games better than Smash Brothers, granted. Like Street Fighter 4, BlazBlue. Guilty Gear, Marvel Vs Capcom, Tekken, King of Fighters etc etc.

But none of those feature Luigi giving Star Fox the elbow Drop.

It's a moot point as to why it gets a lot of attention, and is included in competitions. It's pretty much the only thing like it around these days. Everything else is much more complicated, and doesn't have the same star power.

Bowser >>> Eddy Gordo. (Thats even if you know who that is)
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 2:52 am

I never did like Tekken anyway so fuck eddy.

Only fighters I've enjoyed are SF,Soul Calibur(1 and 2), MvC and some other CapCom games.

I've enjoyed some other unknown games like Flying Dragon for N64. Was a fighting games with RPG elements.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 8:12 am

Ron wrote:
I never did like Tekken anyway so fuck eddy.

Only fighters I've enjoyed are SF,Soul Calibur(1 and 2), MvC and some other CapCom games.

I've enjoyed some other unknown games like Flying Dragon for N64. Was a fighting games with RPG elements.

I PLAYED THAT GAME!

OMFG!

And Ari you played Street Fighter IV like once, and are gonna trade it in.

Now coming from someone that's good at the most technical fighters(SC, Street Fighter), as WELL as being good at Brawl, I can tell you that it's a deep fighter. You don't need cheap infinite combos like the old MvC to be a deep fighter. Infinite combos and super long combos actually make a fighter worse.

And being in MLG has NOTHING to do with popularity.

Soul Calibur is hella popular and it wasn't in MLG(probably because it's button masher friendly)

Only games with pro competitors and a high level of seperation from the newb, to the veteran, get chosen for those big tournaments.

And a game with a high level of seperation from a newb, to a great player=deep.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:23 am

Rofl once? I've unlocked almost every character in the game, and I'm the one that told you to buy it. It just doesn't interest me much anymore. Stuff like T vs C is getting more of my attention, and I love Guilty Gears style so Im gonna cream over BlazBlue. Not to mention it's an Anime within a game. Double bonus.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 9:32 am

Arii wrote:
Rofl once? I've unlocked almost every character in the game, and I'm the one that told you to buy it. It just doesn't interest me much anymore. Stuff like T vs C is getting more of my attention, and I love Guilty Gears style so Im gonna cream over BlazBlue. Not to mention it's an Anime within a game. Double bonus.

LOL, I didn't need you to tell me to by it Ari.

I told you guys I was a huge Street Fighter fan and playing that game since SNES, back when y'all said I'm not good at real fighters so i play Smash.

lol. As you know I NEVER by brand new/full priced games, and I got that game soon after it came out.

And I meant played with us online, like once.



Eh I'll never trade SFIV in. Can play that online all day.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 4:09 pm

Smash is in MLG cuz of popularity? scratch

LOLWUT!?!?

The history of the smash scene has nothing to do with how popular Mario or Yoshi or Bowser or Luigi is. I mean that may cause one to pick up the game (hey look, MARIO IS FIGHTING). But to create a whole MLG scene?

TO WIN CASH MONEY?

WITH HUNDREDS OF ENTRANTS?

ALL UP AND DOWN BOTH COASTS? (west mainly cali and east mainly new england)

It takes more than a household name to do that. Can you think of any game that has done that?

No way. Smash scene started small then gradually matured.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 4:15 pm

SamaT wrote:
Smash is in MLG cuz of popularity? scratch

LOLWUT!?!?

The history of the smash scene has nothing to do with how popular Mario or Yoshi or Bowser or Luigi is. I mean that may cause one to pick up the game (hey look, MARIO IS FIGHTING). But to create a whole MLG scene?

TO WIN CASH MONEY?

WITH HUNDREDS OF ENTRANTS?

ALL UP AND DOWN BOTH COASTS? (west mainly cali and east mainly new england)

It takes more than a household name to do that. Can you think of any game that has done that?

No way. Smash scene started small then gradually matured.

Thank you.

MLG is no joke. Any game in it's tournies is a legit game, ESPECIALLY in the competitive department.

If that was the case, Mario & Sonic at the Olympics would be in MLG.

Now the average casual gamer, would pick up Smash just cuz mario and Pikachu are in it.

But most of those kinda gamers were in Smash Bros. 64 time period.

After that, melee and beyond, turned into possibly the largest fighting game community outside of Street Fighter with god status competitors all around the world.

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Arii

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Fri Jul 17, 2009 11:29 pm

I wonder why.

I repeat, it is the only game of its kind out right now, and for the past few years. To add on it it's unique status trophy, it features the biggest gaming icon of all time- Mario Mario.

Put those 2 together? Bam, instant success. There are no 4 player party fighting games anymore.

Hasn't been a good one since Powerstone came out in 1999.

Only Ron knows about that. He'll tell you.

Think hard about what other 4 player fighter around exists that includes Star Fox, Bowser, Mario, and Ness (not that anyone who plays Smash knows who Ness is)

Rookies.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:21 pm

Lolwut?

You missed what i said...it started small. (Just like street fighter, although street fighter did mature more quickly)

The reason it matured in the first place WAS b/c of its unique 2.5D fighting system. And being a 4 player party isn't why it's so big in the first place. Most pros you hear in Smash play what? 1 VS 1 MATCHES.

2 vs 2 and 4 player free for alls are fun. But those will not put you in MLG.

Take notice that Super smash bros did not enter MLG till it's second game. 4 or 5 years after it was released.

Instant success? Yea maybe in retail. But not MLG.

*edit* 3 years after Melee's relaese


Last edited by SamaT on Sat Jul 18, 2009 1:26 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : in the first *place*)
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Arii

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Sat Jul 18, 2009 2:02 pm

(You're pretty easy to counter)

It wasn't included in the competition probably due to their being other Higher level fighters around, like Tekken.

Since a lot of the bigger names have fallen off and become clones of one another, Smash Brothers stands out even more so. I stick to it getting the majority of its attention due to what it is, not how good it is. (Even though it's pretty good)

Reason it's in MLG though? Because it's a giant breakout hit that will attract more audiences. Think business, not just gaming. If it was about the superior games/necessity of skill, they'd probably put in 5 other fighters before it. I'm sure even you'll admit that.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Sat Jul 18, 2009 3:22 pm

I can tell you have no knowledge of the history of the smash scene.

Regardless of the number of high level fighters around, without the "original" pros doing what they did having local tournaments and whatnot, the smash scene would not exist.

I never said there was a smash scene b/c of the amount of skill that's needed to be able to play it. There are many "unique" fighters that COULD be involved in MLG. But they're not.

Im not saying the popularity of Nintendo's characters have nothin to do with the game making it to MLG. But couple unique (famous) characters with unique (and good) gameplay...then your game will probably succeed. Not guaranteed "instant" success.

If the game sucked it would not be in MLG.

If the original (very small) smash scene had not exited..it would not be in MLG(or at least what it is as we know today).

Idk..maybe another crowd would have picked it up later due to the "clones" and whatnot. But speculating on that in pointless.

Those "typical" fighters did not stat with a small scene. Maybe a small amount ppl initially organized it, but WAYYY more ppl were initially interested in competing in those games than in smash.

How can ppl tell where there's money to be made? When they players willing to play. When are players willing to play? When they like a game(or are bored of other games). Whether or not the original smash scene was just bored, I really can't tell you that, all i know is they spent alot of time on Melee.
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Arii

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Sun Jul 19, 2009 12:13 am

Well, I never said it sucked. I think it's good, and fun.

I just think it doesn't hold a candle to other fighting games, and gets the majority of it's attention due to it being a truly unique title in today's' fighting game market.

MLG, I'm sure, as a business puts in games that are universally loved, and played, not just games that are considered the best, but played by an even smaller number of people.

Melee and Brawl are probably the two best selling Nintendo games of 2 generations. That doesn't go unnoticed, trust me. They know what they're doing, and I think it's intelligent. Very, very intelligent.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Sun Jul 19, 2009 9:46 pm

Yea MLG know's what they're doin.

The original smash scene knew what they were doin too.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:10 am

lol, I dunno why Ari keeps bring up popularity.

That has nothing to do with MLG. All the matches at MLG, are one on one, no items.

So it being the funnest(Which it is), is irrelevant, and the popularity(I own plenty of popular and fun gamecube games that wouldn't make it to the M in MLG), is irrelevant.

Whether Smash Bros. had mario and Link or a bunch of original characters, we'd STILL be playing it, and it'd STILL be in MLG.

I bet you didn't know that when they FIRST made "Smash Bros", it didn't even have Nintendo characters, but a bunch of those "Polygon Fighters" that were featured in the first game.

That game was epic from then.

Actually take a LOOK at MLG Ari.

http://www.mlgpro.com/

I'm sure Street Fighter sells more than Smash.

And there's no 4 player fights in MLG.

It's just a DEEP fighter. Even RAY got the game(Yes longtime Sony stan, and Nintendo hater, lol), used to think the Wii was gay, and not only is he playing that more than any of his other consoles or games now, but now he admits that Smash is a lot more technical than he ever thought it was.

Having infinite combos doesn't make you a good fighter. That actually makes the game worse. Which is why they HAD the fix the issues in TvC, after that crap in M v C. Any game with infinite combos equals fail. Which is why those vs. Capcom games will never compare to Street Fighter III or IV or Alpha.

Don't confuse DBZ style 20 hit combos in the air before they hit the ground, with being a great fighter.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:20 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNlw9JZp5V0

This does NOT = Great or Deep fighter.

Which is why you'll never see it in MLG, despite it having everything smash has. Unique fighter of our time, 3 on 3 tag style matches, Spider-Man vs. Ryu, Mega Man vs. Wolverine, fun to play, etc.

But it's not nowhere near as good a fighter as smash. At all. Ever. It's just whoever gets the first hit and starts an infinite combo= win.

Neutral

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:32 am

I never, ever, ever said a word of that. Not a word.

So I'll be completely ignoring your last 2 posts.

Please contend with me about something I actually said, versus what you think I'm saying.

Kthx.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:42 am

You're saying that it's only there cuz it's popular and features otherwise impossible match-ups.

Sounds like Marvel vs. Capcom to me.

At the time my brain was blown seeing Spider-Man fight Ryu or Magneto fighting Mega-man.

Yet MvC will NEVER get into MLG or probably any other giant tourny based group. It has some weird balancing issues.

You also said that Smash Bros. doesn't offer "variety" because it doesn't have any "real" combos.

So like I said before, having awesome combos doesn't = a good fighter.

Having a high level of separation from the n00b and the veteran, makes it a good fighter. A game like Smash Bros. is based on mindgames, edge guarding, and of course parrying. The alone makes it a deep fighter.

Cuz I dunno if you've fought anyone 1 on 1 yet, but if you haven't mastered parrying and predicting moves yet, you'll get owned.

You're making it seem like it's a generic fighter, because there isn't any giant combos.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:11 am

It's no better than Powerstone, which you've never played. Holler at that and get back to me.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:24 am

Arii wrote:
It's no better than Powerstone, which you've never played. Holler at that and get back to me.

No one's discussing Power Stone, and more importantly, hating on Power Stone. That was a fun game.

Like 4 Player Brawl Matches.

What you DON'T know about however(Probably what you've never done), play a 1 on 1 Smash Bros. match against an experienced player.

and as someone who can bust anyone here in Soul Blade, Soul Calibur 2, Street Fighter 2, Street Fighter II Turbo, Street Fighter Alpha 3, Street Fighter IV, and any other "advanced fighter" I've played, i think I'm pretty credible in the fighting genre mechanics.

And once again Power Stone was a dope game.

You're just trying to make Brawl look worse than it is. And you're not listening to the people that know waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more bout the series than ya.

Also, while Power Stone was a fun and a great game, as far as a technical fighter goes it's not touching Brawl. You couldn't block/parry(fighting fundamentals) and a bunch of the things Smash has.

So like I said before.

Quote :
You're saying that it's only there cuz it's popular and features otherwise impossible match-ups.

Sounds like Marvel vs. Capcom to me.

At the time my brain was blown seeing Spider-Man fight Ryu or Magneto fighting Mega-man.

It got into it because of it's own merit. Not because of Mario vs. Link.

And when you actually start playing online, you'll see the 1 vs 1 fighting against good players is a whole. notha. ballgame. compared to the party style 4 player, random map, items galore game.

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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 12:31 pm

Brawl is way > than powerstone

Lol at powerstone having item comboes lol.

Wtf does powerstone have that brawl doesn't?

And by the same token what does Brawl have that powerstone doesn't?

Priorty, DI(do you even know what this is), Larger UNIQUE roster, 4 types of throws, recovery off stage, more types of mindgames, edge gaurding, 1 vs 1 are way more exciting.
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PostSubject: Re: Super Smash Bros. Discussion   Mon Jul 20, 2009 12:41 pm

SamaT wrote:
Brawl is way > than powerstone

Lol at powerstone having item comboes lol.

Wtf does powerstone have that brawl doesn't?

And by the same token what does Brawl have that powerstone doesn't?

Priorty, DI(do you even know what this is), Larger UNIQUE roster, 4 types of throws, recovery off stage, more types of mindgames, edge gaurding, 1 vs 1 are way more exciting.

Powerstone doesn't even have BLOCKING or PARRYING. I can't believe he even went there.

It's a dope ass fun game, but THAT's the kind a game Ari should be trying to belittle.

lol @ any game without blocking or parrying being a better fighter than Smash.

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